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| Logan Tuley-Tillman (image via Michigan Journal) |
Height: 6'7"
Weight: 309 lbs.
High school: Peoria (IL) Manual
Position: Offensive tackle
Class: Redshirt sophomore
Jersey number: #72
Last year: I ranked Tuley-Tillman #79 and said he would be a backup offensive tackle. He played in one game.
Tuley-Tillman has had quite an adjustment since high school. He was overweight and somewhat sloppy and reached a peak of approximately 330 lbs. Then he dropped all the way down to 285 lbs. before building himself back up to 290 lbs. last season. Michigan struggled on the offensive line at times, but Tuley-Tillman was passed on the depth chart by a freshman Mason Cole. Tuley-Tillman played in just one game, the season opening blowout of Appalachian State.
Whenever I see Tuley-Tillman in practices, spring games, etc., he still has the same inconsistencies in his technique. Considering the failures of former offensive line coach Darrell Funk, it's understandable. But the excuses are gone, and now he has a quality offensive line coach in the form of Tim Drevno. As the only prototypical backup tackle, he could be called upon if one of the starters gets hurt. His length and size are tantalizing, but I think he would be a liability in a starting role at this point in his career. Michigan has a few options on the interior if someone goes down (Patrick Kugler, David Dawson, Blake Bars), but if Cole were to get hurt, it's either Tuley-Tillman, a major reshuffling (Ben Braden, Graham Glasgow), or throwing out guys who aren't ready (Grant Newsome).
Prediction: Backup offensive tackle
That point about OT depth is scary. If Cole got hurt, perhaps they could flip Magnuson out to LT and bring in one of the inside guys you mentioned.
ReplyDeleteAll the starting OLmen are viable at Tackle. Glasgow's maybe an exception but he's also probably their best overall player. Kalis was projected to RT, Braden and Magnuson have already played there.
DeleteCole's probably the hardest OLmen to replace (depending on what you think about Kugler stepping in for Glasgow at C), but all of the guys are flexible. Michigan just needs a backup (ANY backup) to step up into being a starting caliber player.
This is where the losses of Bosch and Miller could really hurt.
I hate to bring the black cloud over but I fully do not expect to go another entire year without a major or even minor injury bug making its appearance on the OL.
DeleteFortunately we have some options however those options haven't proven to be stellar if past history can be trusted.
We are fortunate that Mason Cole has been so good so early. We'd be in a hurt otherwise. I am looking forward to some players development on the OL.
ReplyDeleteOh yeah. Cole is going to be a top draft pick. We hit a jackpot with Cole.
DeleteLTT has missed opportunities the last couple springs. Last spring, Cole blew by him as an early enrollee very quickly, even though Cole was not thought of as a LT prospect. Then this spring, the coaches seem to be giving up on Braden as an OT. But LTT does not appear to be a candidate for that spot either. Both his quickness and strength looked sub-par to me in the '15 spring scrimmage. Missed chance, especially with the new staff.
ReplyDeleteThis is a make-or-break fall camp for LTT. I suspect that the coaches will really be motivated to fast-track Grant Newsome at LT (if he is as talented as advertised). Harbaugh will have no problem using a freshman as a back-up OL if he thinks the upperclassman competitor does not have the goods.
Cole has the makings of a good LT at UM. But he might have a brighter future in the NFL at C. Would be nice if another good LT emerges and allows for some position flexibility for these guys.
There's no reason to play a true freshman in a backup role. If you're going to burn an OL's red-shirt it should be to start.
DeleteI don't want Newsome to be the next Cole, I want him to be the next Long or Lewan. Even those guys red-shirted.
"Harbaugh will have no problem using a freshman as a back-up OL if he thinks the upperclassman competitor does not have the goods."
DeleteI suspect you're right ... for Harbaugh, "The Future is now."
I don't mind using red shirts *meaningfully*. I'm not sure we saw that in a lot of cases the past few years.
It's 2015, let's not cling to some 1993-ideal. Freshman OL who are ready to play are getting meaningful snaps all around CFB. Gone are the days when a more talented FR OL will sit behind a sub-par starter just to preserve the redshirt. I think Drevno played three true-FR last year at USC. Murphy, Peat, and Garnet all played as true-FR OL at Stanford. Jake Fisher played extensively as a freshman at Oregon (without starting!). Times have changed, and they have changed for a reason.
DeleteIt would be an especially idiotic strategy to maintain some 1980's vintage RS rule with OL when you are going through a coaching transition and your position group has only has two "plus" starters, and one of them is a 5th year guy. Harbaugh has a huge sense of urgency and needs talent in a hurry. And if that talent happens to be young, he needs to accelerate the development curve. That happens by being active on Saturdays. Guys like Harbaugh, Drevno, Shaw, Chip Kelly, etc. understand this.
@ PS
DeleteI hope this doesn't come across as disrespectful, but you're cherry picking outliers in your examples of non-red shirts. Kids bodies change tremendously between 18 and 20 (or later) and the need for SC is near universal. Further, OL is a cerebral position that favors mental maturity as well. I strongly disagree that freshmen starters are the new norm, but time will tell which of us is right.
Phil
I think Lanknows point is the utility we gain from using Newsome as a backup LT would be far outweighed by having him around for a 5th year. Long and Lewan were really good as RS JRs. They were great as RS SRs. If Newsome is that much better than LTT, it would probably be worth playing him. But if he is similar or not significantly better than LTT, we would get better value red shirting him.
DeleteI'm usually on the side of calling red-shirts an antiquated ideal, but OL is one spot where I can't agree. It's one thing if you're running a spread offense, where things are a little simplified for OLmen and speed and agility are as prized as heft and strength - it's another when you want to overpower people.
DeleteShould a freshman OLmen play if he's the best guy - of course, but that's a big assumption to make before the season.
OL isn't a position where people rotate often and MIchigan is slated to return 4/5th of it's OL in 2016. Part of the rationale for playing a true freshman is if they are slated to start the following year. If it's clear that Newsome (or another freshman) are that good - that they are the very top of the backup OLmen, then it would be reasonable to play them in case of injury or in preparation for next year. But it's not worth losing a potentially dominant 5th year of a guy to get a few snaps against UNLV and Indiana.
Coaches need to win now, they need to play their best players, and they need to accelerate development. They also need to recruit kids who are able to contribute as early as possible. And kids coming onto campus now are much better known-commodities than they were 20 years ago, since they are all working with personal trainers and doing public football activities year round. Kyle Kalis was training in specialty OL schools all through HS and Wyatt Shallman trained with Barwis 18 months before arriving at UM. More kids are getting access to high quality training very early now. Times have changed and thinking of all freshman as completely raw from an S&C standpoint is just flawed.
DeleteI think there is a big disconnect between fans' perception of the value and need for redshirts, and how coaches are handling them in modern football. Almost all fanbases bemoan wasted redshirts. But the guys who get paid $$millions continue to "waste" them. Urban Meyer says that if he has to redshirt a lot of kids, he is not doing a good enough job recruiting. In a transition year where the incoming staff is apparently not thrilled with the roster, I would expect a healthy number of freshmen to play. If the '15 recruiting class would have been stronger, I think we would have seen a major youth movement this season.
I don't think anyone is arguing against playing the best guys, getting early contributions, or winning. And nobody thinks of all freshman as "completely raw" either.
DeleteKalis and Kugler were about as ready as OLmen can be for action based on their HS background, as you pointed out. And yet - they weren't good enough to play as sophomores let alone freshman and weren't blocked by good players. It looks like they WILL be good enough as upper classmen. That's because people get better over time.
Furthermore, consider Tate Forcier - who was about as groomed as possible for college football readiness. In hindsight, he could have really used a red-shirt year to get himself right off the field, and it would have paid HUGE dividends for Michigan if they could have done in that in the long run (Forcier would have probably fit a lot better under Hoke for example...but I digress.)
Most development happens on the practice field, not games.
Red-shirts are wildly overrated and an antiquated objective. You are right about that. They reflect a failure of coaching in many respects and are suboptimal. But OL are an exception to that, more often than not, and so are QBs. There's still value in development and having 5th year guys at OL, QB, LB, and S can be a major advantage.
Meyer is right, but you know what - he still red-shirts almost all of his OLmen and most of his QBs.
I think it's very hard to rank the top backups at OL right now. Those seem to be Kugler, Dawson, and LTT at the moment. I don't know what the pecking order between them is (who the first-man in is if a starter goes down), if it's position flexible (Glasgow, Magnuson, and Braden should be able to move around readily given their experience), or if the coaches will go T for T, G for G, and C for C for clarity sake.
ReplyDeleteWhat I do know is that more often than not there is an injury on the OL at some point and a backup is needed. I also know that we have a new staff, the OL was mediocre last year, and that the unit's improvement is absolutely CRITICAL to this team's success given the lack of fireworks expected in the passing game.
Put that all together and I would argue that Dawson, LTT, and Kugler probably belong somewhere in the late 30s to early 40s. The counter-argument to that is that none of those 3 are proven and therefore any of the 3 could step in. But I think a pecking order WILL develop and one of those 3 WILL end up starting some games. I just can't tell you which one and I'm not sure the coaches can yet either.
"His length and size are tantalizing..."
ReplyDeleteEww, Thunder...first all the "hot chicks" have better abs than the dudes from '300' and now you're discussing this about a dude???
/s
Two full years in a major D1 football program should be enough to tell you if you've got what it takes or not. If he is listed as a 3rd or 4th string option at OT breaking out of fall camp I think we will know that another highly ranked prospect is a miss.
ReplyDeleteBraylon Edwards had 3 catches after 2 years. Tom Brady was considering a transfer because he was so buried and had attempted 2 passes after his 3rd year at Michigan.
DeleteAnd before you argue that that was a different time when Michigan was loaded -- Braylon's competition for starting gig in 2001 was Calvin Bell, Ron Bellomy, Jermaine Gonzalez and Tyrece Butler.
So no, you can't call LTT a miss as he enters his 3rd year. OLmen generally take longer to develop than any other position.
If memory serves, LTT was a 2013 early enrollee. That would make the most recent session his third round of spring practices and five semesters total on campus. That is definitely enough time to show your stuff. We are speculating about his future from the outside, but I am sure the coaches know what they have in LTT at this point.
DeleteBeing an EE doesn't make you any older. It just means you hit campus a few months earlier and get extra practices in. The biggest reason OL red-shirt is physical maturity. The other reason is technique and spring practice is only going to put a dent into that.
DeleteAnd - again - Edwards and Brady weren't starting after their 5th semester on campus either. Some of yall would have booted Edwards and pushed out Brady to make way for Henson, Mignery, and Navarre.
Isn't he the player who got mad at you for calling him raw and pointing out problems with his techniques?
ReplyDeleteYep. He and David Dawson both did not like what I had to say about them.
DeleteAnd both of them are not seeing PT right now. Kids really could use some humility.
Delete