Defensive end Luiji Vilain, after four years in the program, has entered the transfer portal.
Hit the jump for more.
Vilain was a 4-star, the #5 weakside end, and #57 overall in the class of 2017. He was an Under Armour All-American out of Alexandria (VA) Episcopal by way of Canada. I gave him a TTB Rating of 84 (LINK) before bumping him up to a 90 (LINK).
Unfortunately, Vilain suffered multiple injuries early in his career, preventing him from playing in 2017 and 2018. He played in seven games in 2019 with 7 tackles, 1 sack, and 1 forced fumble. He followed that up by making 4 tackles in five games as a backup in 2020.
I think Vilain's injuries sapped him of some of his athleticism, and we never saw him hit his ceiling. His "sack" and "forced fumble" came against Notre Dame in a blowout rainstorm in 2019. Sadly, he never even flashed significant potential once he got on the field at Michigan. One of the main reasons I am not high on Shaun Nua is his inability to develop Vilain into even a decent player. Even when Vilain got on the field, his technique and reactions were subpar, reminding me of the Rich Rodriguez years.
Aidan Hutchinson and Taylor Upshaw should be the frontrunners to start at defensive end in 2021, though new defensive coordinator Mike Macdonald may throw out a different personnel grouping. Overall, this departure leaves Michigan very young and inexperienced going into next season, when a bunch of new faces will be forced into action.
Yet another HS All-American to not deliver in a winged helmet
ReplyDeleteBest of luck to the young man. Hope he got his degree, and can invest the next two years at a decent team with a strong Master's program
I remember the talk when he came to Michigan, that he had explosivesness at the snap, the quickest first step of all DEs in the class. There was hopes of him being on the field sometimes with Chase Winovich, and how they could both get into the backfield quickly. Never saw it.
ReplyDeleteHere's to better days!
Joseph dreamed dreams
"he never even flashed significant potential once he got on the field at Michigan."
ReplyDeleteI think that is the salient point here. I'm less inclined to see Vilain as a victim of fortune or missed opportunity. More inclined to see a misevaluation coming out of HS (by coaches as well as recruitniks).
The recruiting rankings are relevant in aggregate but high variance. Take them with a grain of salt and don't hold onto that stuff beyond where it is useful. If Vilain had been properly rated as a 3-star that wouldn't be so much consternation. Some guys just max out at a certain level (e.g., Denard in college) - it's very common.
We'll never know if Vilain had stayed healthy and gone to say OSU if his ceiling was much higher than what we saw in AA but I am skeptical. Maybe it wasn't a good fit with Nua but on the other hand we've got Hutchinson and Paye playing at all American levels so that's not a great crutch to lean on for Vilain.
The simplest explanation is that he just isn't that good. Hopefully he gets a chance to have more success at a lower level program.
As for Michigan in '21 it's a bummer to lose depth on the DL. But it's also no surprise. This is similar impact to other recent 5th year transfers. A guy who can help but isn't going to change the arc of a season unless the frontline starters go down. Upshaw, Welshof, McGregor, Ojabo and company will get their shot.
IMO
-Lank
Bashing players ... wow
Deletetrollllololol
Delete-Lank
I disagree. You can watch his high school senior season highlights, and he's just not the same player:
Deletehttps://www.hudl.com/video/3/6424195/585c130db534592a58054697
Maybe it really was injury that changed his play. Don Brown likes players that are quick and aggresive to get into the backfield. So if he didnt get to be that under Don Brown, where there was always opportunity to do it, maybe it was injury that changed that quickness.
DeleteThat and lack of development (coaching). But some fans just wanna dog the player
DeleteGreg Mattison is gone so i havent ecpected development from the D line.
DeleteYou're saying i dogged the player??
DeleteBy your historical standard, YES
Delete"The simplest explanation is that he just isn't that good" and suggesting he should have been a 3star, vice the 4star All-American High School status earned, is worse than anything posted about Joe Milton, right here on TTB
You are what you hate
That's not my comment.
DeleteLOL JE getting emotional again. Welcome to the party Unknown.
ReplyDelete-Lank
My emotions are limited to a smirk - and sometimes a chuckle - during your annual meltdowns
Delete*a burner account for TTB is just so Lank of you
LOL. Limited is a word that does come to mind, yes.
Delete-Lank
@Thunder
ReplyDeleteI get what you are saying I just don't put much stock in highlights against HS guys. Seen too many Terrance Robinson, Jerod Ward's etc.
If I said "Wilton Speight was headed to the NFL until he got hurt and was never the same, here is his highlight reel against Maryland, Illinois, and Hawaii" you would rightfully scoff.
We have more and better info. Maybe the injury changed everything. I doubt it because there was plenty of opportunity to recover.
But maybe you are right. I know I haven't been able to dunk since I had a knee injury many years ago. But I can't blame it all on that if I'm being honest.
-Lank
It's not even about him blowing last chubby left tackles. It's about the way he moved. If you edited out the opposing players and just watched video of Vilain doing getting off the snap against air in 2016 vs. 2020, they wouldn't look the same.
DeleteSpeight is a different story, because ball placement, timing, etc. is dependent on other players. You could throw the ball from the 50 yard line to the goal line, but if you edit out the WR/DB...all you see is a 50-yard pass, not that it got intercepted, caught, fell harmlessly to the ground, etc.
I think we both agree college success, at DE or QB, generally takes more than just physical ability.
DeleteI am just not convinced that Vilain was on track to be a really good player at the college level based on HS highlights. I get what you are saying, and acknowledge that injuries can be impactful. I just put a whole lot more on what happened in college than highlight reels because it's so much more info.
I think Speight was physically and mentally affected by the broken collerbone in '16 and the broken spine in '17. He had proven himself as a player at the college level before the injuries and wasn't very good after them. There's a direct correlation. Wasn't the same. And yet - I still wouldn't say he would have been a great QB who got derailed by injury. He had his chances to recover to perform at an elite level but never did at UCLA nor at NFL practices.
Ultimately, injury or no, he wasn't a great player in college. Certainly the HS highlights didn't show his limitations as a player beyond not having an elite arm.
Vilain situation is more speculative than that because he never performed at the college level. I think if he had had some standout games, even in backup situations, during a healthy freshman year this would be a stronger argument for the "missed opportunity because of injury". For now all we have is the HS highlight and there are plenty of physical standouts at the HS level who don't perform at the college level even when they are all the way healthy. Happens for any number of reasons.
I acknowledge you could be right on the injury impact, but we'll never know. In my view it's more likely to be a misevaluation than an injury derailed career. Both are common enough to be plausible. Might have been a, b, or some combination of both. I lean to the less speculative explanation.
-Lank
In Speight's words, I'm not a "shoulda/coulda/woulda guy" when it comes to assessing his career or Vilain's.
Deletehttps://twitter.com/WiltonSpeight/status/1256018797250711554
-Lank
@TrollE93
ReplyDeleteI'm talking about the on-field performance of guy who was on the team for 4 years and didn't do much. It's not a personal attack to say he wasn't that good of a player at Michigan - it's a fact. 11 tackles in 4 years.
Maybe he will do better elsewhere. I hope he does. But his greatest accomplishments at Michigan on the field was earning a backup spot. Off the field he was a standout earning academic honors before graduating.
Contrast the above with attacking the character of a freshman while claiming he will transfer because he lacks patience. "especially if Shea finishes the season healthy again". That kid waited his turn, became a starter, and he's still here (for now anyway). Milton may not be the player some of us hoped but he's done nothing but exhibit class and resilience during his time at Michigan. Your character assessment was wrong.
No hate here. And the only dogging I see is what you're doing to yourself.
-Lank
Blah, blah, blah
DeleteNo one here ever attacked Milton's character - that's you either making stuff up, or lumping this board with stuff you read elsewhere
You're speculating an injured kid was never that good. With Milton, I only address his subpart play (pick a year/game). Mine is objective and performance based, yours ... is not
Same with Speight. He had some good games, but none in a big game. Even before injury, he didn't play well against tough competition, and even at sparty, JH game planned around speight's limitations
Stop making crap up, and it's easier to ignore
haha. If I said that trash I'd try to forget too, but it's a direct quote from you.
Delete-Lank
BTW - Milton was hurt too. No excuses right?
DeleteName ONE time I went after his character, just ONE. Fact is, the only time I ventured away from on-field performance for any michigan player, is when wilton speight was complaining to his dad about fan criticism during the Amazon series, then proceeded to criticize his GF during her game... It's like your claims here of racism. You can't prove a point, so you incorrectly along accusations, hoping noone will call it out. You fail
DeleteAs for Milton, we do not know when he was injured. We do know that his performance mirrored his first two seasons, and a busted hand is not what makes a QB spin into a sack, or throw into the chest of a defender
Again, watch the film, not just the boxscore. It makes a difference Lank, just trying to help you out sir
https://touch-the-banner.com/2019-season-countdown-55-joe-milton/
ReplyDeleteComment 1
"I can see Milton transferring, especially if Shea finishes the season healthy again".
He "lacks the patience to ever see it through"
This was after his freshman year. But hey, you "watched the film" on an 18 year old, saw those 4 pass attempts, and knew everything you needed to know to pass judgement.
Meanwhile, I was too busy reading page after page of box score print outs and tap tap tapping into the ultimate tool in analytics - the spreadsheet - to see what was obvious to anyone with a Rivals subscription - Milton wasn't going to be around much longer.
-Lank
It's like you get off on lying
DeleteFirst, you took my quote out of context (full text below). The OP and all 100 posts discuss the growing trend of transfers, especially at QB. No one bet, promised or guaranteed a Milton move, and I specifically said "IF" one QB left, my guess would be Milton ...
Second, neither quote - even out of context - is about character. Both are about the situation, the latter about him in the pocket. I've said from the beginning with only cannon arm, and lacking other attributes, Milton needs reps - lots and lots of live reps. G5 or even FCS get QBs into the league because they develop through game action ... milton need this, in bunches. After three seasons in a P5 program, my opinions have not been proven wrong
Try harder Lank. This BS didn't pass
"Agree it’s doubtful both QBs stick around. I can see Milton transferring, especially if Shea finishes the season healthy again
As a TrFr, those numbers aren’t bad, but did you see some of the armpunts? It’s almost like he closed his eyes before tossing the pick at ohio. That’s perhaps understandable, since it’s CBus in years … but then he threw one right into the chest of a backup LB in the spring game. I think he needs a lot of time & reps, but lacks the patience to ever see it through
We’ll see"
Please. Patience is part of character. So is perseverance (i.e., "see it through". You thought someone else didn't have it but you were wrong - it was just projecting. Kind of like you calling anyone a liar.
Delete" I think he needs a lot of time & reps, but lacks the patience to ever see it through."
You said it but you won't own it. Typical JE. Have a nice weekend.
-Lank
Lol, questioning a QB (or Point Guard) patience is character assassination
DeleteWay to go Lank, stay you
You said something.
Delete>No I didn't. Prove it!
Here is proof.
>Liar!
LOL
Lank: you called out his character
DeleteJE: no, a accurately assessed his performance on the field
Lank: liar
JE: prove it
Lank: gets busted editing my actual words
Everyone: not surprised
Lank: talks sh:t, hen struts around like he won
Still strutin. The full quote - which I linked to - just adds filler.
Delete-Lank
Liar
DeleteBut I get it. Being wrong pains you ... it drives you mad ... meltdown is near
You said something.
Delete>No I didn't. Prove it!
Here is proof.
>Liar!
LOL LOL LOL
-Lank
Lying doesn't make someone right, no matter how badly you want it. You're no more right today than you were Friday, or even last fall when you called the board racist
DeleteI get it, it hurts to be wrong. For your sake, I'll let up here. For your own mental health, I suggest you take a breath, and find something else
GO BLUE
"meltdown is near" you say? Deja vu.
DeleteIn the linked post you were talking about meltdowns a year and a half ago. Since that time you stepped away from posting for a few weeks or months(?) multiple times.
Maybe you forgot. I've known some underemployed people who spend a lot of time smoking pot who seem to forget everything, so I've seen this before. Frequent reminders necessary. Anyway,
That was another time when you claimed to forgot what you wrote and tried to act like it didn't happen until I linked to it and called you out.
The troll posts have a consistent theme. Talk about your feelings (mostly about being upset and disappointed) or talk about Lank. Here's a thought: quit trolling and go read something interesting. Maybe you'll say something worth responding to besides your poor attempts at shittalking.
-Lank
Please. Three years in a row you threw a fit and left the board. You survived 2020, an abbreviated mulligan season
DeleteI went away to honor a bet. But again, even wrong, you mislead. Desparation is seeing in. I'm in your head
You mean you lost to me, failed to honor the bet, forgot about it, denied it, played the "SHOW ME WHERE I SAID" game, and then left again only after I called you out several times.
DeleteMy spreadsheets always have room for you good buddy.
-Lank
More lies
DeleteI came back that time, after you commented about me keeping my word. I wasn't tracking the days, and took that as the end date. As soon as it was pointed out, I corrected it
That's integrity Lank. Meanwhile, you continue to twist & spin. At least this time you aren't crying over it ... yet
Yeah, so just like I said. You lost, failed to hold up your end of the bet, got called out for it, then left to try again. No lies told. But I do see your excuses, needless details, diversions, and projections.
DeleteIntegrity is nice (even if it takes you multiple trys) but so is accountability and truth. You can say liar all you want but you refuse to own up to your own BS. Too busy inventing it for someone else it seems.
I mean - it's not very hard to say - "Yeah it looks like I was wrong when I called out a freshman QB's character. He stayed not only through the end of the year but the following year too. He seems to be a patient guy after all." But you won't do it.
Oh well. See ya next time troll.
-Lank
Just because you misrepresent details doesn't make you right. This is supported by the name calling ... maybe meltdown is coming after all
DeleteLOL - you mad I called you a troll? Don't troll and no one will call you a troll.
DeleteTry to remember that one.
-Lank
I don't get mad - my emotions remain in tact
DeleteMaybe that's what leads to meltdowns, your inability to make a point and failure to get under someone's skin? Must suck to be all-around ineffective
LOL. Buddy we know your emotions are in tact it's all you ever want to talk about. That and Lank. Stan93 can't get enough.
DeleteGood you learned a new word ineffective but when you lose bets, fail on the payout, and then get called out for it, maybe look in the mirror. Whether you forgot, don't pay attention to detail, struggle with comprehension, or just straight up lie - doesn't matter.
In other news. Here is what the guy you said "lacks the patience to ever see it through" thinks is worth saying, since his actions weren't enough for you.
https://twitter.com/Qbjayy7/status/1354999402532921350
LOL. More lies I'm sure.
-Lank
I live in your head, rent free
DeleteSharing a tweet? LMAO, tate forcier tweeted too ...
Hope the best for Mr Milton. But going into year4, nothing we have seen suggests he will meet his glorified potential
Try harder Lank. I'm obviously too important for you to ignore!
-Lank
DeleteAdded since JE like to imagine people creating fake accounts to...do something. Telling on yourself again JE.
Rent free ... in your head
DeleteSays the guy responding to every post within a matter of minutes.
Delete-JEs Burner
You can't help it. All I have to do is post, and you're triggered
DeleteInsert Spiderman pointing jpeg
DeleteLOL You can tell JE one of those people who call everyone snowflakes and then cry and moan if someone calls them Karen or tell them to put on a mask to go in the grocery store.
-Lank
Says the guy who actually cries, moans, and runs away each year
DeleteI'm chill 😎
Bill Gates is always telling people how rich he is or else how would they know? Karen93 is very calm and influential, just ask them.
DeleteThis has dropped to the 2nd page now so I'll see you on another thread where you can TRIGGER MY MELTDOWN AHHHHHHH AHHHHHH AHHHH!!!!! with your lame cliches sorry I mean cutting insights and wit.
But wait youre in my head so maybe you don't even have to write anything at all... Try that one.
I'm sure you'll fail.
-Lank
The replies are getting longer, and wreak of desparation. Definitely rent free
DeleteGreg Mattison retiring
ReplyDeleteBurned a lot of bridges for those 2 years in Columbus. Too bad - he'd make a helluva "analyst" in AA.
Delete-Lank
Michigan has contacted Central Michigan player in transfer portal, 6'4", 305 lbs. DT Mohammad Dialo. He had 3 sacks, 7.5 TFL's, and 16 total tackles in only 4 games last year. Talk about filling an area of need!!
ReplyDeleteTheres positive vibe about him coming to Ann Arbor.
Joseph dreamed dreams
Warinner gone. The best coach on the team since Jim Harbaugh was hired, Jedd Fisch, and Greg Mattison very close seconds. Mike Zordich has been great too--also gone.
ReplyDeleteBut the OC, DL, and LB coaches are still here. Whats going on? Maybe Jim Harbaugh isnt as brilliant anout football as I thought. Or maybe he can't see the forest for the trees.
Umbig11 says, but cant confirm, that there was friction between Warinner and Gattis/Harbaugh. I'm telling you, I would send Gattis out the door so fast to keep Warinner that the momentum would carry him half way around the world.
Apparently LB Quivarious Crouch is in the transfer portal. I won't get any hopes up, that with the current LB coach, he will come to Michigan. Michigan was one of his final teams before he chose Tennessee.
Man, my hopes for a fairly fun season are shot. Mike Bellamy is the new OLine coach. Or is it Sherrone Moore? Neither could carry water for Ed Warinner. From excellence to another on the job trainee position coach.... Isnt that what the whole staff is going to be?
Oh well, I'm used to looking for great college football to watch from other teams by now.
Heres to hoping for some good news out of Ann Arbor soon....
(not holding my breath)
Joseph dreamed dreams
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteOh no ... no one saw this coming
ReplyDeletehttps://sports.yahoo.com/michigan-qb-joe-milton-enters-transfer-portal-creating-more-questions-for-jim-harbaugh-171006453.html