Former Indiana wide receiver Donaven McCulley has committed to Michigan.
McCulley is a 6'5", 200 lb. player who started his career at quarterback in 2021 before switching to wide receiver for the past three seasons. He was just the third true freshman quarterback to start a game for Indiana, completing 35/82 passes for 475 yards, 2 touchdowns, and 2 interceptions in 2021; he also ran 64 times for 135 yards and 2 scores. He caught 18 passes for 184 yards and 1 touchdown in 2022 and then made 48 catches for 644 yards and 6 touchdowns as a junior in 2023.
McCulley entered the transfer portal following the 2023 season and had interest in Michigan, but he was convinced to return to Indiana with new head coach Curt Cignetti coming to Bloomington. Unfortunately for McCulley, Cignetti brought some of his own transfers from JMU, who ended up winning out and leaving McCulley mostly on the bench. He caught just 2 passes for 21 yards while playing in four games. If he had continued to play beyond four games, he would have lost the ability to play in 2025 and presumably finished his college career as a backup for the Hoosiers. Instead, he announced he would enter the transfer portal after four games, which allows him to play one more year.
Michigan needs help at the receiver position with top receiver Tyler Morris entering the portal and not much size on the roster. The "big" target on the squad is 6'3", 182 lb. Amorion Walker, who was injured for much of the 2024 season, so McCulley immediately becomes the biggest target for incoming freshman Bryce Underwood and whoever else Michigan can land in the portal.
McCulley is the third transfer to come from Indiana to Michigan in recent years, joining TE A.J. Barner and QB Jack Tuttle, both of whom joined the Wolverines prior to the 2023 national championship season.
A part of the class of 2021, McCulley was a 4-star, the #24 quarterback, and #223 overall in the class of 2021.
Can he still play QB?
ReplyDeleteSeems too tall for WR. Most WRs are not this tall. More likely to be successful if he was closer to the prototypical 5'10-6'3 range.
Shhhh nobody tell Sherrone I said this.
About what was to be expected. Our RunFirstRunOften, SMASH offense isn't going to attract the most elite, but Moore added size without compromising Hands, Agility or Speed. He's an upgrade in a low output room, having more Catches, Yards & TDs in his all-Conference 2o23 season than everyone else in our WR coprs has in their entire careers
ReplyDeleteGet two more and we should have a playmaker between the three
There are reasons why McCulley sat the bench at Indiana. As his height is an asset, it's logical to assume there are other limitations. I haven't watched him closely enough to assess his game but below is one review that covers exactly the issues.
DeleteThis reflects my argument elsewhere, that if your pros are your height and you aren't an elite talent like Julio Jones or Randy Moss or DJ Metcal or (name your preferred big WR) then you probably have some substantial limitations in your game. The inverse is true if you are lacking in height and producing, you probably are making up for it with great skill (like Amon St Brown) and or speed (like Tyreek Hill).
In McCulley's case the issue does not seem to be hands (which is very good) but it does seem to be a lack of explosiveness and route running (which is bad). His height is good but it comes with tradeoffs.
In other words -- Moore added size while compromising skill.
It is not really very clear at all if McCulley will be an upgrade relative to Morris for example. We'll see. To some extent it depends on how he is used. Michigan has not really been a jump-ball throwing type of offense since the Denard days. Most people know that those are low probability strategies and high turnover risk, so a lot of teams (especially ball control emphasizing teams) don't like to do it -- even if they have guys who can win more than their fare share like Nico Collins.
https://www.thedraftnetwork.com/2024/06/14/donaven-mcculley-scouting-report-nfl-draft
Strengths:
Elite catch radius
Prototypical X-receiver build
High-point specialist
Reliable hands-catcher
Concerns:
Limited route tree
Consistent separation
Raw (only two years at WR)
Explosiveness early in reps
Lank, yes but unfortunately, he offers something that none of our other WRs do plus those concerns apply to basically all of our WRs so at least with McCulley we are getting the height and hands.
Delete@ Lank 1:50 p.m.
DeleteThis is just one of those things where I go, "Yeah...and?" I don't really understand the point.
I think we can all agree that Donaven McCulley is not Julio Jones, a guy who was an elite recruit and got drafted in the 1st round of his junior year.
What he does do is he offers size and hands for a team that didn't have that combo in any individual player aside from tight ends.
You're famous for saying "trust the coaches" but you ignore a huge number of coaches who value size. College teams and NFL teams look for size to help out their receiving corps. It's rare that a team is happy running a bunch of 5'11" guys out on the field. A lot of teams have one of their top 2-3 guys (maybe not #1, sure) who has a decent frame. The Lions signed Tim Patrick to go along with St. Brown and Jameson Williams. The Bengals have Chase and the 6'4" Tee Higgins. The Texans have Nico Collins with Dell and the (now injured) Diggs.
Either the coaches are right and being tall-ish is helpful, or wide receiver size doesn't matter and the coaches are wrong. Either way it goes, you're going to end up wrong in some way.
(NOTE: Nobody is saying a 6'4" guy with zero skills is better than a 5'10" guy with tremendous skills.)
If mcculley's "weakness" is route running & separation, it's a strength relative to the 2o24 group, substantiated by getting open to make more catches for more yards ... if his "weaknesses" is explosiveness, it's a strength relative to the 2o24 group, substantiated by the bigger plays, including TDs over 4o yards (we got ZERO from our current corps)
DeleteThis is why I've been asking for a year now regarding our "playmakers:" compared to what?
Well, compared to a guy playing for Indiana's 3win team, what we had was lacking a great deal. That makes this pickup part of an upgrade that is desparately needed
*I'd post Tyler Morris & Peyton OLeary Draft Network reviews, but they haven't been good enough to earn one
We do have Portal ratings though. McCulley is not elite but rated the #37WR &188 Overall, right about what was expected for a RunFirstRunOften SMASH offense
https://www.on3.com/db/donaven-mcculley-37977/
Meanwhile, Tyler Morris is #95WR & 556 Overall. He's likely to stay, because there is not much Demand
https://www.on3.com/db/tyler-morris-117881/
@Thunder
DeleteThe "yeah and" is that there are limitations and tradeoffs here. Nobody is saying the difference is "zero skills" vs "tremendous skils" but if you focus on size you are going to get qualifying comments like "good speed FOR HIS SIZE" that make that tradeoff clear.
All that matters is the results. If Michigan is able to leverage McCully's size -- great! It worked. Historically, they have NOT really had success with big jump ball targets who have below average speed or receiving skills. There is widespread recognition that jumpballs are generally a bad idea, a low probability proposition -- Harbaugh avoided them almost completely.
I would say Devin Gardner is probably the best example of success of such a player and there are definitely different perspectives on Gardner as a WR. I think he sucked, but he played a role and got some yards under Hoke.
-------------------------
I never said Trust All Coaches. Nor did I say Trust All Coaches on all things.
I said Trust Coaches in the context of depth chart decisions of Michigan coaches. I was critical of Harbaugh for some things and Hoke for other things -- like focusing on size at WR.
Now I'm being critical of Moore for the same thing.
-------------------------------------
Being tall-ish is helpful but coaches shouldn't seek it out. That's my opinion. I'm well aware that some do.
The Lions are not a good argument. They were content to have a WR corps whose top 3 were 5'8, 6'1, and (generously) 6'0 going into 2024. They let 6'3 Josh Reynolds walk away prior to 2024 just like they let 6'3 DJ Chark walk away prior to 2023. They have produced one of the best offenses in football with that group. Their TEs are tall and that's enough. Patrick has emerged into the rotation as a proven veteran, but he was not targeted specifically to add size to the roster. He was a practice squad signing, one of several at WR. He is also 5th on the team in receiving yards, barely ahead of David Montgomery.
The lions have been cycling through multiple guys on the practice squad to fill out depth. They absolutely have NOT emphasized size in building up their WR room. One example of that is who they are drafting. Since 2020 the WRs they have drafted have been 6'1, 6'1, 5'11, and 6'0.
Tall WRs exist! Some of them are really good! Nobody is arguing this.
It's also true that short WRs exist and some of them are really good. Pointing out one does not really make a good argument for superiority over the other. Since you can't prove that tall>short or short>tall it follows that emphasizing height probably isn't a smart thing to do -- even if some coaches do it.
@jelly
DeleteIf your bar is O'Leary -- yeah I'm going to agree that McCully is an upgrade relative to a walk-on. Just like the Fresno State QB is an upgrade over our walk-on QB.
I don't think that's the bar. The bar for me is closer to Roman Wilson, Cornelius Johnson, and Ronnie Bell. Michigan has had NFL caliber WRs consistently despite not putting up big counting stats.
We have tall guys who lack other skills already on the roster. Walker is fast even. Adding height just to add height isn't moving the needle. It has to be something more. If McCully has great hands that is a needle mover.
We don't agree on Morris. If he stays, which I hope is true, I think he'll be WR1 again. I think he's a good route runner and I think he played as much as he did in 2023 and 2024 because he's a good WR.
McCulley could be a nice complement and brings a different skillset. Different, not necessarily better. I do agree with Thunder that different skillsets in the WR group can be helpful. I just don't think height is an important "skill".
What trade-off? Did MICHIGAN lose a specific quality in acquiring McCulley? As far as we can tell, he's superior to every WR we had. Not just in stats either, but even his PFF score screams "upgrade"
DeleteWho said McCulley is only there for jumpballs? Did Coach Moore even mention such a thing?
If we're trusting the coaches in the context of Depth Charts only, I bet it's safe to assume - barring injury of course - that McCulley just leapt ahead of the WR room
Short WRs do exist! And some are good, great & elite. Not in the 2o24 MICHIGAN WR room though. Coach Moore is addressing that, and ADDING size
*doubting the integrity of the Lions players' Height just days after arguing in favor of online listed Heights is wild
#generously
@Lank 1145AM
DeleteOLeary & Morris are the only Draft eligible WRs we had this year Lank; I think you know this, but are trying to talk around Draft sites ignoring them
You ignore that I compared him to Morris too, while switching to Roman Wilson, who left a year ago ... that's not a trade-off. Implying so is misleading at best
As for Morris, do you have 4o times? Shuttle times? The speed probably favors McCulley, if only slightly, but still. The route running should be in favor of Morris - a HS WR - but the stats don't show that. McCulley was able to produce far more in one season than Morris did in his career ... Moore got us an upgrade in every way measurable
@ Lank 11:28 a.m.
DeleteThis is a lot of discussion about what will/won't work with McCulley, but we've already seen him do it. This isn't a projection based on high school film or FCS film like C.J. Charleston. McCulley has already been the leading receiver for a (bad) Big Ten team. He had 48 catches for 644 yards and 6 touchdowns in 2023. That included 137 yards against a solid Illinois defense and 96 yards against a very good Penn State defense in 2023.
If Michigan can't make it work with McCulley, it's not because of McCulley's lack of skills. We already have proof that he has the hands, size, speed, and capability to be fairly successful in this league.
This is a free agent signing of a veteran NFL (okay, NCAA) wide receiver. We know what he is. We're all going to be surprised if he gains 1,200 yards and scores 15 touchdowns, but we should also be surprised if he catches 5 passes for 50 yards (barring injury).
@jelllly
DeleteI'm not talking around draft sites. That's your fantasy. I am telling you that McCulley is better than a walk-on, who you brought up. It is not surprising that a walk-on is not listed on draft sites. What are you talking about? Stop dreaming up new fantasies every day.
If your point is that McCulley is better than Morris because he is on draft radars and Morris isn't - OK. That's a valid argument, if that's what you are saying. It doesn't affect my opinion very much nor do I care very much but I understand your point.
Both comparisons are being made above. To O'Leary - a walk-on - is inconsequential. To Morris - Michigan's #1 WR last year - it is relevant. We don't agree there. To Wilson - Michigan's #1 WR in 2023 is also relevant.
---------------------------------
On Morris vs Mcculley
McCully was able to produce, mostly in 1 game against Illinois, on a limited scale at Indiana when he didn't have much competition. When he did - he was benched.
Morris played a key role when he was the #3 WR behind 2 guys drafted to the NFL. When he ascended to #1 WR the following year......his QBs were absolute garbage and the passing attack was woeful. I maintain that's on Campbell, Warren, Orji, and Tuttle -- NOT on the WRs. Other folks disagree. That's fine. These are opinons.
Morris was a highly ranked WR recruit. And he beat out a bunch of other highly ranked WR recruits for playing. He seems like a good player to me and he made some plays. I like him and think he was underutilized. A star? Probably not. An NFL draft pick? We haven't seen enough to think yes. But he has proven he can make plays and he has spent 3 years beating out a lot of other talented players for opportunities so that means something to me.
I hope McCulley is an upgrade but I'm not convinced. He has more production by about double -- but Morris was playing on playoff contending teams in 22 and 23 so had a small role. McCulley was on a playoff contending team in 24 and got benched. So I dunno -- very different circumstances.
Do you have any proof that route running is better for McCulley than Morris. That hands are? We're just supposed to assumed because McCulley put up a big game against Illinois in 2023 as WR1 on a 3-9 Indiana team that he's better "in every way"? I don't think so!
CJ Charleston had 500 yards and 4 TDs in 2023 -- doesn't mean he's better in "every way measureable" than Michigan's returning WRs in 2023. Context matters. You can't just compare stats head to head and call it no contest.
It's subjective right now. Let's get them both on the 25 roster and maybe we can answer this question pretty directly.
@Thunder
Delete"If Michigan can't make it work with McCulley, it's not because of McCulley's lack of skill"
I don't agree with you Thunder. I think McCulley's lack of skill may have contributed to why it didn't work with Cignetti.
Sometimes mediocre players put up respectable stats on bad teams. Roy Roundtree had a 935 yard season with 7 TDs on the 2010 team and 580 yards on the 2012 team. I don't think very highly of his WR skills despite "proof" that he can play, he wasn't that fast or good at getting open or good at winning contested balls.
I agree McCulley will catch more than 5 passes for 50 yards. That's really totally beside the point. Amarion Walker can do that. Payton OLeary can do that. Who cares.
The point is that Michigan CHOSE to target a guy, because he is tall, even though he is a guy who doesn't have a particularly impressive resume. They could have made a different choice. But they chose to prioritize a guy who does NOT have great speed and has been called out for route running and ability to get open -- which seemed to play out against OSU and Michigan in 2023 and overall in 2024.
There is some reason this guy who is "proven" was benched in favor of a 5'9 WR and a 5'11 WR and a 6'2 WR at Indiana.
"*doubting the integrity of the Lions players' Height just days after arguing in favor of online listed Heights is wild"
DeleteSt Brown has been listed at 5'11 other places and was under 6' at the combine.
https://www.nfl.com/prospects/amon-ra-st-brown/32005354-4241-5291-a564-57e98d35161d
Another LIE you are caught in in this quote. All I argued is the McNamara and Davis have the same list height -- and both are equally dubious. Both are dubious, like I said.
Calling out your BS jellly. HOLD IT UP
@Blue in NCDecember 18, 2024 at 4:05 PM
DeleteYes I mean the WR room needs to add players no doubt. The issue is are we settling for a guy who seemingly lacks in WR skills, because he is tall.
I'm not mad we got McCulley I'm concerned that Sherrone Moore once again is demonstrating poor judgement in his strategy. My baseline expectation is not the 2023 WR room.
McCulley is taking up a slot on the roster, using up NIL money, etc. It's not purely additive because there are many other options on the table.
I can make a case that Mikey Keene is an upgrade at QB over the guys we have and that's probably true, but it's also OK to be disappointed that who we got is well below the expectation for a Michigan caliber starter.
something off the table because that recruit is taking up a spot, using a scholarship, etc.
We are CHOOSING to take a guy who got benched by Indiana as a junior. We do not have unlimited roster space so anyone we bring in is taking someone elses place.
McCulley could be a great addition, but he's not one I personally am very excited about because his best trait seems to be height and height isn't very import for being a good WR. Having good hands is far more interesting and enticing. I hope it works!
19 Dec at 5:35PM
DeleteFantasy? On 18 Dec at 1:5oPM, YOU brought up a draft site ... unless that was one of your other usernames? Lemme check ... nope, it was you!
I countered that neither of our draft eligible WRs were good enough to even have a profile, then compared McCulley to Morris Portal rankings, and then McCulley to all of our WR stats (even one season v Career)
Lank's Draft site: McCulley > 2o24 non-playmakers
Portal: McCulley > 2o24 non-playmakers
Stats: McCulley > 2o24 non-playmakers
B1G Honors: McCulley > 2o24 non-playmakers
This looks like an upgrade, by every (available) standard
Key role? Catching passes in less than half our games, for under 2oo yards and ONE touchdown isn't very key Lank, at least not in this comparison
Morris made one play - an RPS+2 when coaches matched him against a LB. Nothing outside of garbage time besides that, and even then nothing memorable ... you're going to HS recruiting rankings because there's nothing more at the college level to point to, while McCulley earned all-Conference honors
YOU are the one insisting there was a tradeoff for size. Do YOU have any proof? I too am in wait & see mode, but point to YOUR draft site, portal rating & PFF score as indicators of an upgrade. If that's not enough, he was #3 in conference in contested catches and has SIX games with +5o yards, while Morris has ONE ... an objective upgrade, but YMMV if you're a feelings guy
Comparing CJ Charleston (FCS YoungstownSt) to a WR who produced in our conference and Division is stuff made of ... fantasy
*LMAO: "we are settling for a guy who seemingly lacks in WR skills, because he is tall" ... the Draft site YOU shared disagrees with this claim ... hahahahahaha, not even YOU agree with you
19 Dec 5:59PM
"all you did" is carry on about Jaydyn Davis height for over a week ... be honest Lank
How did I lie?
Ah, "every accusation is a confession" ... I gotcha. Might be time for another username change
@ Lank 5:46 p.m.
DeleteWait a minute...Roy Roundtree got a chance in the NFL with the Cincinnati Bengals. That type of thing was seen as confirmation that Wilton Speight was a good quarterback. If you don't think highly of Roundtree's WR skills, does that also mean you don't think highly of Speight's QB skills? This is confusing and contradictory.
McCulley has produced at the Big Ten level. And no, not just against Illinois. You ignored my comment above. 4 catches for 96 yards and 1 touchdown against #13 Penn State, which has had a good defense for several years, is nothing to scoff at.
Also, would it be a huge surprise to think that a guy who was a QB early in his career might take two or three years to improve at his new position? The end of the 2023 season saw his production increase (28 catches, 420 yards, 5 TDs in his final five games).
You can also look at his PFF scores and see that he graded out at 76.5 for the year, which is a pretty solid grade. (Tyler Morris graded out at 60.8 for the 2024 season, and Fredrick Moore was the highest graded WR at 62.4.)
I know you don't like tall receivers, but the numbers are the numbers.
Waking contradiction ... Roundtree/Speight shot at the League only matters if it supports the narrative of the day
DeletePFF, stats, portal rating, draft potential ... data gets in the way of feelings
@Thunder
DeleteThat's a valid point -- I have a lower opinion of Roundtree as a WR than Speight as a QB, but their NFL careers seem to be the same (1 camp invite and then cut. the end.) So perhaps I shouldn't. -- It's fair to say they are both competent/solid but unexceptional college players.
Maybe Roundtree's a bad example but I stand by the point that sometimes mediocre/bad players put up stats on bad teams and good players don't put up stats on good teams. Kalell Mullings could have been a 1000 yard rusher if he was on Indiana instead of Michigan in 2023. Cade McNamara couldn't have put up a 140 passer rating in 2021 if he wasn't surrounded by NFL talent all around him. Context matters and in McCulley's case he was on a terrible team that gave him a lot of opportunities.
I also think you have a valid point that McCulley could be a guy to take time to develop. The increase in production from the first to the second half of the season supports this in 2023. Unfortunately, getting benched in 2024 undermines that argument.
I like tall receivers! Braylon was awesome. Nico Collins was awesome. Colston Loveland was a WR for us about half the time -- he was awesome too. DJ Metcalf is my second favorite WR to watch right now (after ASB).
What I don't like is WRs who lack WR skills -- a lot of times those guys tend to be tall (e.g., Gardner, Stonum, most Hoke recruits). If a WR can ball and he happens to be tall that's a nice bonus to have. If he's tall and he can't ball, there is no point. What I see is a pattern where some coaches get enticed by size but ignore a lack of skills. Seen it so many times that it has made me skeptical of any player who is tall because in that instance they are going to either be a 5 star if they have the skills or they are going to be something lower and not have the skills. Sometimes they can develop them, most of the time they don't.
---------------------------
As for PFF grades - can we compare apples to apples for McCulley and Morris? What are their 2023 scores?
In 2024 McCulley was benched so I'm guess it wasn't good and Morris was functionally benched by an inept passing offense.
Bottomline on McCulley is that it seems like you are pretending like 2024 never happened. That doesn't make sense to me. The 2023 season was not so impressive that you can ignore everything that happened after it.
I give Morris a pass for 2024 season. I know he did this: https://x.com/PFF_College/status/1741963480465322004
That's against the NFL-level secondary of Alabama. I don't know if McCulley has ever done anything as impressive or important in his career. It's just one play -- but Morris saw a whole lot of playing time on a national champion and generally did well with limited opportunities in 2024.
I genuinely don't know who the better college player is. IMO, it could go either way.
So if the team sucks, it HELPS McCulley produce ... but if the team sucks, that HURTS Morris production
Delete#walkingcomtradiction
@jellly
DeleteMcCulley is the 43rd ranked WR in the Portal per 247. We know he is tall so he checks that box. Why is he ranked so low down?
Morris is unranked by 247 in the portal at this point. Seems like they haven't gotten around to him? Not enough tape to judge?
As a recruit Morris was the #18 WR and #104 player nationally. McCulley was not ranked as a WR but was the #223 player nationally.
On On3 they give Morris an 86 ranking (3 star) and McCulley an 88 ranking (3 star). So that source is agreeing with you but not by much and definitely within the margin of error.
I stand by my take that it is not clear that McCulley is an upgrade over Morris. He is taller though! If you discount height (as I do) then it seems like Morris might be the more skilled WR.
Proof will be in what they do in 2025. It could go either way right now, IMO.
@jelly
DeleteNice try jelly but we all know you aren't built for this.
Michigan 2024 offense threw 1600 yards on <300 attempts. The #1 TE had more catches than the 3 top WRs combined. The team passing rating was 111.
Indiana 2023 offense threw for >2500 yards on >350 attempts. The top 5 leaders on yards were ALL WRs. The team passing rating was 128.
Indiana's 2024 offense that benched McCulley threw for >3000 yards on 327 attempts with a passer rating of 179.
Different contexts. Different conclusions.
2 bad offenses but - Morris wasn't thrown to in 2024. McCulley was in 2023.
2 good offenses but - Morris played a lot in 2023. McCulley was benched in 2024.
@Lank 1256PM
DeleteAgain, leaning on dated HS rankings because college results don't suit your narrative ... but if you go that route, one clearly underperformed
I shared on3 ratings 18 Dec at 11:27PM ... Tyler Morris ranking is #9o2 Overall, while McCulley lowest is #23o Overall (highest #131). At their position, Morris highest is #112 (on3) and lowest is #142; McCulley highest is #38 (on3) and lowest is 39 ...
McCulley is about what I predicted for RunFirstRunOften SMASH, while no one seems interested in Morris
What does this mean for 2o25? Nothing yet, but as an option, every available indicator assumes this is an upgrade, even if not by too much
@Lank 1o4PM
MICHIGAN offense is SMASH ..
I've been told that defenses "sellout" to stop or run, which should create opportunities for a playmaker at WR to get YAC ... we did not
Indiana meanwhile had no run game, but defenses like PennSt still had trouble with WR1 (McCulley) that they didn't with WRs on other teams not named ohio
In his entire career, what was Morris best game? The RPS+2 against Bama was a single play, so maaaybe NW this year? Nothing special, with his only YAC coming in garbage time, but still no TD? McCulley's is harder because their are options, picking between Illinois, PennSt, Maryland, Sparty ... all opponents we're familiar with
How's that for context?
#n0tbUilTf0rtHiS
@jelllllly
DeleteI listed a whole bunch of stuff and only briefly mentioned HS rankings but OK to you that's "leaning on". LOL. Some sadsack might call that a "lie".
Otherwise, thanks for the data. I acknowledge McCulley could be an upgrade but I don't agree it is a sure thing.
------------------------------------
"should create opportunities for a playmaker at WR to get YAC"
It should but if your OC and QB are incompetent it doesn't.
----------------
I agree that Morris hasn't had any great games. He sat behind 2 NFL guys his first 2 years (more impressive than who McCulley sat behind this year) and this year he was an in an offense that failed to function (worse than what McCulley experienced in 2023). So McCulley's circumstances have been FAR more favorable.
Morris is nothing special? Yeah that's fair. Who are you arguing with?
#fantasy
McCulley is not special either. As his rankings illustrate.
HS rankings was the only favorable take you had on Morris, despite replying twice in a matter of eight minutes. My guess is that if you had anything objective, *you'd write about it*
DeleteAnyway, the "whole bunch of stuff" was addressed too Lank. Pretending it wasn't is ... lying
So the pass game is blamed on the QB & OC, but not the poorly rated WR room? Gotcha, lots of excuses but I expect that
"Morris is nothing special" yet he's a playmaker ... Gotcha, about the kind of logic to be expected
"I acknowledge McCulley could be an upgrade but I don't agree it is a sure thing" ... WOW, we agree! And I didn't have to beat you into a name change first
#quotes
*Lank on 23 Dec at 7:o4PM*
https://touchthebanner.blogspot.com/2024/12/tj-metcalf-wolverine.html?m=1
#links
LOL. I've been consistently positive in my assessment of Morris blaming the terrible QB play and coordinator for their lack of production. I've also been positive on the WR room as a whole, relative to you, for all of 2024. Now it's just about one post. Some might call this a lie.
DeleteNow you want to pivot to rehash the definition of playmaker that was established way back when. Some players aren't playmakers. Some playmakers aren't players. WATCH THE RERUN.
RENT FREE FOREVER!
Back to counting my posts lil fella
#obsessed
Every accusation is a confession.
DeleteHere, in another failed GOTCHA attempt, you are admitting you agree with my statement that McCulley might NOT be an upgrade. It's not clearly an upgrade at all. This after calling it that over and over again and insisting "Moore got us an upgrade in every way measurable".
Seems like my #facts #links #data #evidence changed your mind.
A christmas miracle!
Another L along the way, but I'll take it as a sign of growth. Congrats.
Hold it up with pride.
Consistent? In just a matter of minutes (1:17PM to 1:35PM) you refer to WR as a room "we all agree was not strong" AND blaming the OC & QB, while "POSITIVE" on the wide receivers
DeleteThat's not a gotcha. By every available measure, McCulley is an upgrade, which is why you couldn't use more than HS recruiting rankings. This does NOT mean McCulley will do any better, because we do not know how injuries will play into things, how he will click with the QBs, or even what the offense will look like
Both can be true. Neither has been argued by you. Only fantasies
*SEVEN posts on one thread, right in the middle of Christmas Eve, but you couldn't do better?
#tooEasy
haha. Another attempt to create a contradiction that only exists in your fantasyland. Meanwhile:
Delete""I acknowledge McCulley could be an upgrade but I don't agree it is a sure thing" ... WOW, we agree!"
vs
"McCulley is an upgrade"
Either it's a sure thing or it isn't.
You've said both in this thread.
je93December 24, 2024 at 10:34 AM
vs
je93December 26, 2024 at 10:52 AM
You contradict yourself movements apart.
No fantasy here - these are your statements.
#quotes
Hold it up.
That's not a contradiction: by EVERY measurable detail available, this is a clear upgrade. McCulley could start spring as WR1, not like the offense and transfer again, making this upgrade meaningless to next fall's production ... both are true, so you avoid taking on those points
DeleteUnless you're misrepresenting again? Probably. Nah, certainly!
It is tho. Either it's a sure thing or it isn't.
DeleteYou've said both in this thread. Contradiction.
It's not an upgrade if it doesn't show up on the field.
It's not an upgrade if Morris outproduces McCully after they switched spots.
It's not certain. And you know it. Because you agreed with it.
Not even you agree with you.
Who said it's a sure thing?
DeleteStatistics speak to PAST performance, and only indicate potential. Comparing 2o23 McCulley to our 2o24 WRs, we have an upgrade in every measurable way (except for HS rankings, lol)
Go ahead and root for Indiana Lank
#rentfree
#page2
#resolution
You, but you forgot. And no performance isn't potential they are different things.
DeleteLike the 3rd string RB potentially replacing the NFL bound RB with no problemo. No performance to prove it but potential is there. Oh wait...my mistake LOTS of examples of it happening. LOLOLOL.
Just not with Marshall who was not emerging according to you but fell right into the potential becomes performance example list on 12/31.
Keep those memories fading and those fantasies going lil fella.
When did I said McCulley was a sure thing? Where's your quote? Here's mine:
Deleteje93 on 26 Dec at 1o52AM "This does NOT mean McCulley will do any better, because we do not know how injuries will play into things, how he will click with the QBs, or even what the offense will look like"
#quotes
#exposed
"Like the 3rd string RB potentially replacing the NFL bound RB with no problemo"
LMAO, what! Lying and then akin stuff up again, but talking about memories fading ... 'somethin somethin every accusation is a confession'
#exposed
Jordan Marshall emerged at the Bowl, not before
#iamright
#resolution
#page2
Funny that the emergence was discussed before the bowl....but you denied it.
Delete#wrongagain
#asalways
You offer no stats ... just feelings
Delete#iwinagain
#resolution
#page2
Stats or no stats (there were stats, you argued with them), either way, the fact is you were wrong. I said a guy was emerging and he thrived and it was completely predictable. 2 NFL backs out and a freshman in --- NO PROBLEMO.
DeleteSorry about your real life world. Enjoy the fantasies!
white flag hold it up etc
Deleteenjoy page 2 season when you can fantasize all to yourself
christmas is coming!
two posts ... you weren't satisfied
Delete#submission
*checks stats*
No, 7 carries for 17yds, with a long of EIGHT & no TDs in garbage time during a NW blowout is not emerging ... unless Tavi Dunlap suddenly emerged
1 carry for 3yds in The Game is noteable for earning trust ... but 3yds is 3yds. Not emerging ... well, maybe in fantasy land. Somethin, somethin every accusation is a confession
#jeDub
*no problemo? Well, how did Ben Hall do? Behind the same OL, against the same Bama Defense? You've brought the RB issue up on three different (old) threads now ... you gonna dodge that question here too?
#resolution
#page3
"A guy that’s going to be a great leader, great teammate, obviously have the ability to play and got to be a great fit,” Moore said of what he is looking for in a portal quarterback. “That’s going to be the No. 1 piece"
ReplyDeleteOh no, Moore is emphasizing traits that don't include experience, accuracy, arm strength or mobility ... is he wrong??? Or is the Head Coach simply listing qualities he wants to ADD to the QB room?
https://www.freep.com/story/sports/college/university-michigan/wolverines/2024/12/21/michigan-football-quarterback-fits-transfer-portal/77105541007/
Rent free.
Delete"Ability to play" kind of covers those items jelly. Nice try but hold up another L.
"Ability to play" is also lacking in the current QB room. Michigan already has height in the locker room so they don't need to ADD that.
DeleteHeight has nothing to do with most WR skills -- if it did WR rooms would look like basketball teams.
*kind of" ... you're interpreting again. THAT is rentfree, and leads to two posts a minute apart ... of course it's time for a name change!
DeleteWhat is ability to play if not some combo of "experience, accuracy, arm strength or mobility". Let me know which QBs can play well without any of those things. I'll hang up and listen.
DeleteCount the posts.
Hold it up!
you lost at "kind of"
Delete*SEVEN posts on one thread, right in the middle of Christmas Eve, but you couldn't do better?
#tooEasy
Thanks for waving the white flag as usual.
DeleteWhen challenged to make a cogent argument -- dodge to counting posts!
Not built for this.
Is that the lie you tell yourself? Would that be a "fantasy?"
DeleteActual words v the interpretation of a poster known to be averse to the truth ... but yeah, let's pretend the white flag is mine
"the interpretation of a poster known to be averse to the truth"
Deleteyes you sure are.
every accusation is a confession
HOLD IT UP
===================
Since I know you are reading this, obsessed, hanging on every Lank post, needing to respond. I'll let you know this. My new years resolution (except starting in February LOL) is to mostly avoid posting on anything falling off to the second page of the site. So you can have all the fantasy wins you want going forward little fella. Lots of whiteflags coming to your imagination soon. It's gonna be a great year!
PS May be exceptions for particularly interesting conversations. Since that's never the case with you, you are free to enjoy your fantasies all by yourself. And post your fantasy football results while you're at it. So many jelly dubs coming in your mind!
Haha, rent free is living in your New Years resolution
Delete#checkmate
#whiteflag
#iamright
Your dream comes true.
Delete#obsessed
Quit dodging and answer the question posed to you Jellly!!
ReplyDeleteLankDecember 20, 2024 at 12:56 PM
@jellly
McCulley is the 43rd ranked WR in the Portal per 247. We know he is tall so he checks that box. Why is he ranked so low down?
Elite height, low ranking. Sacrificing something else by targeting height????
https://www.maizenbrew.com/24327202/michigan-football-film-study-transfer-portal-donaven-mcculley-indiana-wide-receiver-sherrone-moore
DeleteThe tradeoffs listed in this article are:
speed: "Far from a burner", "His lack of speed limits him"
route running: "He is not great at getting separation", "His route-running needs some polishing and his route tree needs to expand"
Michigan has prioritized height over other traits that matter at WR.
That said, I think it's fair to acknowledge that McCulley is not JUST a tall former QB trying to make it work. He's got a couple years under his belt at the position by now and has developed some skills, enough to maybe overcome his lack of speed or separation ability.
P.S. I actually found the article to be very encouraging but his limitations as a "possession" receiver are clear. I don't consider that to be too much of an insult that some do. You can win with heady possession receivers, as long as you have playmakers in other spots.
That's not a dodge, as it's been addressed: there's nothing elite about McCulley. Even though available data & information suggests he is an improvement, it's not by much and certainly not predictive
DeleteIn fact, I said from the beginning our RunFirstRunOften, SMASH offense would prevent us from landing elite guys. Many of us have said so dating back to 2o21 ... no surprise, but you disagreed then too
*another name change ... got you feeling desperate already?
Two replies, getting bored & desperate!
Nothing in this articles says or even implies trade-off. Just the latest in misinterpreting or purposefully misrepresenting information
"far from a burner" and "he is not great at getting separation" ... from a guy calling for context, this article offers none. How does McCulley's onfield speed & separation compare to say, Tyler Morris? Judging by production the answer is anywhere from little to satisfactoryily improved
M&B refers to our WR room as "guard infested" while complimenting McCulley to adding "reliability," not just size. They also point to his "fighting in a phone booth," "playing like a pitbull in a greyhound’s body," and "excellence at making contested catches away from his body with a wide catch radius" ... I am easily reminded of Bell's pass to Morris in The Game, when the latter lacked the size, strength & DAWG to make a play
M&B also shows more clips of YAC than I can remember any of our WRs getting last year (or ever), so I appreciate the read
*in our history of disagreeing, this is the first time you've shared an article that directly relates injury with playing time ... yet in this case, you're quick to use the term "benching"
"Most expected him to take another leap in 2024, but a Week 1 injury derailed his season. By Oct. 1, McCulley had left the team and preserved his final year of eligibility"
"RunFirstRunOften, SMASH offense would prevent us from landing elite guys"
DeleteExcept it hasn't! We just put Bell, Johnson, and Wilson into the NFL. We recruit 4 stars consistently. And we just landed a top 100 guy in the 2025 class. Measure however you want (NFL star like Nico Collins, NFL draft picks, high school star ratings) and Michigan produces excellent WRs on a regular basis, even with a run heavy attack. True for Harbaugh as it was for Carr.
"there's nothing elite about McCulley"
This is a lie. He has elite height for a WR.
Moore prioritized this trait.
"Even though available data & information suggests he is an improvement, it's not by much"
Not by much. Only a suggestion. Indeed.
Not even you believe you.
This is why you keep pointing to an upgrade over the 2024 room, that we all agree was not strong. Nobody thinks that's the bar we are shooting for.
Yet that's the (artificially lowered) bar you need to latch onto to try and hold up your argument that Moore isn't sacrificing something here.
Moore CAN recruit better players with better speed and better skills to the roster, but chose to emphasize height. At the expense of other things. A tradeoff. Juuuuuuuuuust like I said.
Do you have any evidence that a guy not called out for lack of speed (morris) is slower than a guy called out for lack of speed (mcculley). Lack of evidence = lies?
Oh and best of all is you blaming McCulley's lack of performance on injury after ignoring guys breaking bones (e.g., Milton) and saying it doesn't matter because he was healthy enough to play. McCulley played in 2024. He got hurt in the first game but by that point he had already been benched and called out by Cignetti in the spring. He missed all of 1 game and then was back by 9/14. At that point he was established as a minor backup and chose to sit out.
https://www.si.com/college/indiana/football/donaven-mcculley-no-longer-on-indiana-football-roster-01j94pwc9jv7
You have no consistency. Not even you believe you. Just lies.
You can talk around this one like all the other ones till you are blue in the face, but you fool no one, not even yourself. HOLD IT UP.
Relevant section from the link on McCulley being benched and then injured, not benched because of injury.
Delete"During the spring, Cignetti challenged McCulley, saying he needed to “pick it up a little bit.” Still, McCulley was considered to be an important piece for the Hoosiers as fall camp opened.
Once the season began, it was clear McCulley was going to have to work his way into the rotation. He did not start the first game. Myles Price, Elijah Sarratt, Miles Cross and Ke’Shawn Williams were all targeted more as the season played out.
McCulley’s one catch against Florida International in the opener came with a price. He suffered a helmet-to-helmet hit and missed the next game against Western Illinois.
McCulley returned for Indiana’s game at UCLA on Sept. 14, but he’s only participated in 11 plays in the three games since his return."
If you are just average at everything you can be ranked as a mediocre prospect like McCulley. Arguably this is the case with Morris. No real deficiency but no standout trait either.
DeleteIf you have an elite trait and ranked as a mediocre prospect - you must be below average at other things. This is the case with McCulley.
The NFL draft profile points that out.
McCulley may or may not be better than Morris. Good chance he will outproduce him in 2025, but not a sure thing. We'll see.
Regardless, it is clear here that there is a tradeoff for choosing to emphasize height over other traits - speed and separation ability are the tradeoffs in this case.
The benching by Cignetti wouldn't happen if there weren't some deficiencies for a guy who is 6'5 and made honorable mention all big 10.
I'm just glad that in McCulley's case it is NOT hand and NOT ability to body up and make tough catches.
Again, despite the tradeoffs, I found the links above to be encouraging. McCulley could be a solid possession receiver for us and seems like a clear upgrade to O'Leary in that role. He could also be stepping in to a lot of what Colston Loveland did when he was doing a lot of WR duties in 2024.
I'm glad they got him, even if he's not "my type" or Harbaugh's type of WR. I'd rather they focused on college-relevant skills and traits, but even if he lacks athleticism, he can be an asset, especially if he uses his size and experience to be a good blocker and leverages his QB experience to know how to get to the right spots.
Count the posts baby!
DeleteHold it up.